All Army Cadets: I am trying to get the Army put back into Army Cadets. I complained there, I havent got a response back though. All Army Cadets should do the same.

YOU MUST BE KIDDING

(I have a feeling that this is some PAFFO's brillant idea that is suppose to gve us enpowerment - give me a break.)[and yes before you ask Mud I dislike PAFFOs as much as CFRC]

This is not a personal attack on you Argyll just a general comment of going to get answers from an organization that thinks cam combats is cutting edge or giving a multi-million dollar contract to a loser company such as White Star (LSVW fame) to replace rusted out wheels that should have been foreseeen and then declaring that the effects will be minimal!!

If the DND want to know what is going on in the trenches they should moniter forums like this one.

Better they should monitor it, find out what we saying, then DO something about it. But really, how would monitoring this website be of any use to them regarding the MLVW? The damage is done. Ditto the LSVW. Once the problems have passed to the stage of troops bitching about them, I think it is too late.

Instead of the US Army reserves getting the stuff as it was rotated back to the continental US, because they were in essence pretty much kitted out, they offered us. We turned it down and countries like Mexico, Israel, etc benefited.

They offered us MBT's, APC's, light skinned wheel (Hummers), logistical support vehicles etc. I believe there was also a cascade proposal of munitions, arty pieces, MLRS, and VLL AD and associated training.

This same cascade model saw Israel receive a quantity of Electronic warfare aircraft, Hughie�s, Kiowa derivatives, Black hawks, Apaches and CH-53's. I am sure, not certain that this was brought to the table as well.

I believe the main problem was that it would not create any jobs in Canada. What was missed is that the US was including within the cascade a quantity of spare parts, training, etc.

This BS of being brought into the US sphere of influence. Really, NORAD, the various distance early warning systems, etc. Did I miss something? How about our current doctrine? Hmm.

Did not the UK go to the Falklands and learn some serious hard earned lessons. They changed their doctrine accordingly. An army fought is an army taught. For a while it looked like we were going to benefit from this experience, but no. All that is missing here is the disbanding of our current regimental system and adopting a numbered system. If any of the old dogs here can honestly say they never heard that one specifically, you were not paying attention in 95, 96 and 98 when hints of it surfaced at NDHQ.

So back to the moral. We, yes Canada have done quit a bit of cascading to our allies. Belgium with our CF-5's, guess where our Chinooks went. How about the CF-104's? Speaking of 104's, anybody remember what happened to the deuce and a half. We almost gave them to Turkey, but they wanted a modernization done. We almost did it, however some astute parliamentarian caught wind of it and the cost. Made nice targets.

How about the Centurions from CFE? In a quit swap brokered by the US, we almost gave them to Israel. Someone blew the whistle. Check the dates; incidentally coincide with the re-gunned M-109�s in CFE. Always made me chuckle to know that the Centurion turrets wound up in mountainside bunkers in Switzerland and the hulls were sold as farm scrap and ended up with reworked T-55 and T-62 turrets in, you guessed it, Israel.

Then there was the strange twist WRT the CF-101 Voo Doo. We wanted the single seat attack version. At about the same time the US was starting to expand it�s role in Viet Nam. The two-seat interceptor was less effective as a fighter, tadda, we get the newer 2-seat intercept, and the single seat fighter went to Viet Nam. Incidentally, for those who have yet to learn of this, that is when Canada truly entered the nuclear race and armed aircraft in Canada with nuclear tipped anti air weapons. What, no US influence here I�ll have you know.

As an afterthought, how many of you old dogs are aware that the US just offered NDHQ an option to lease 4 or more C-17's, yup same offer to the UK. There seems to be a split camp at the palace over this. Ironically, Gunner, remember our tete de tete over the 2020 doc, recall some mention of the need for a greater heavey lift capability. I know where my money is placed, and if I were you I would invest in several Ukrainian or Russian heavy lift companies. God forbid we get rid of the Air Bus fleet and go with something that is operatioanally effective, cost effective (cost recoverable - who says we can not contract out our services) and designed for the role.

As an aside, it blew me away several times in the near past to have seen three and four CF Air Bus on the flight line by DFAIT in Ottawa.

My point, those who fear being brought into the US camp or sphere of influence live in an artificial bubble. One that makes me question their perception of reality, of course some of these are the same folks who strongly feel we have a stong military and political global presence. Yes we are respected, but we are by no means a real heavy weight in the political world. We have lost face in NATO, and the UN loves our money, ideals and soldiers, but we are not a member of the Security Council.

Hey, what's your version of what happened to the HMCS Bonadventure? Did it really become razor blades and auto frames in Japan or did it become an aircraft carrier in the Indian Navy? Perhaps, just perhaps, the navy is still hiding it up north in the icefields until the day the government isn't looking and they will float down the Rideau Canal! <grin>

I do agree with you that people in Canada believe we are larger players on the world stage they we actually are. While we are fairly well off economically we have a small capablity to "power project" across the globe. Every mission we will try and get a handfull of officers as UNMOs or in a HQ or perhaps a company strength organization. This gets us a seat at the table and we can be part of the discussion without having to pay a large price. To a degree it has worked alright. I don't know if it will in the future.

By the way, Canada just finished its two year position on the Security Council. Remember Bob Fowler? He was our ambassador during that time.

Bob Fowler, hmm, check what it was he was doing. We are not nor will we ever, unless the UN re-engineers itself, ever be part of the inner security council. Oh by the way, he did not exactly leave in a goood light. They created a wonderful position that non member nations could chair and be involved within the inner sanctum as a chairman. Yes, Canada was the nation who got the ball rolling for this. Incidentally, when the security council with draws to its smaller boardroom to discuss matters of significance, such as UN operations and sanctions, you guessed it, it is a closed door affair. No membership, no presence. Once they have made a decision, they go back onto the main floor, present it and the body votes.

Bomarc missiles and the Avro Arrow, hmm. The Bonny, remember all the compacts of the early 70's, LOL.

No, not x files, just pay a bit of attention to UFI. Something that it would appear you have not. Most of this stuff is now open source, so get your head out of where ever, and next time check it out first.

I will adnmit when I make a mistake, but if all you have are slights of ref, onward and upward.