Author
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Topic: Air Defence
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Gunner
Moderator
Member # 39
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posted 20 July 2021 00:28
Starlight1,I spent awhile tonight on the internet looking for a picture of said wpn system, however, I was unable to find one. I've only experience with the US Army Avenger system. I'm not an AD Gunner (Mr Magoo may be lurking around ... whereever bird gunners hang their hat when they are not being used), however, in answer to your questions: 1) Is this system an effective and reliable weapon? I'll have to go with the information you brought from Tom Clancy (who am I to argue with Tom Clancy?). However, in a perfect world, the Marine Corps LAV variant would fit in quite nicely with our movement to medium weight, all wheeled fleet of LAV. But, there is nothing wrong with the AD Eqpt (ADATS, Gun/Skyguard, and Javelin) that we have. The trouble is we don't use it for what it is designed for and it's only become an expensive air force training tool. The Army has not been kind to the Air Defence. 2)Would it be more cost effective? Probably not as we spent a billion dollars on eqpt we don't use properly. What's to say we would spend more money (that we don't have) and purchase new eqpt (simply because it is wheeled) and don't use it properly either. 3) Could it play an important role in air defence in Canada? Same answer as question 2. Hope it helps. If you get anymore information on the vehicle, plse post again.
Posts: 96 | From: Army of the West | Registered: Jun 2000
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Mr Magoo
Veteran Member
Member # 67
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posted 20 July 2021 11:19
One of the problems we have in Canada is that ideally we would want an AD weapon system to be forgiving, which is a good thing for Allied pilots and aircraft.The Stinger system is a "fire and forget" missile, the Javelin on the other hand is not. An operator can cause the Javelin missile once fired to leave its track, go ballistic (straight up) and self-detonate harmlessly away from the once-intended target. This is of course an important safety feature because for both systems the IFF (identify friend or foe) is entirely left up to the "Mark 1 eyeball" of the operator. In this day and age of coalitions, we can face the Iraqi Air Force with their MIGs, and have the Syrians on our side with their MIGs. The Stinger's other failing is that it is a heat-seeker, so it's best to fire it at the back of an en aircraft. In a lot of cases in the fashion that Canada deploys AD manpads systems that means the aircraft will already have dropped it's payload of munitions on or about the intended target. Having said that the Americans have a different system of employing AD. They saturate an area, believe heavily in interdiction missions and in ambushes with the Stinger. They pick potential fly routes and cover them, when the en flys by everybody can open up. Canadians for largely economic and philosophical reasons allot areas of responsibility and track targets passing off the option to fire from one detachment to another as the aircraft enters a det's area of responsibility and then exits. The AD LAV veh variant is an exciting system, rapidly deployable, robust, able to carry a number of missiles, easily transportable by air, sea, flatbed, or rail. Currently in Canada we're using the LSVW to transport AD manpads dets, which is not an optimal solution. It can't go everywhere, and can't keep up with tanks and APCs on the march.
Posts: 24 | From: Montreal, Quebec, Canada | Registered: Jun 2000
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Mr Magoo
Veteran Member
Member # 67
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posted 21 July 2021 11:30
Indeed a M113 could be configured. The ADATs uses a M113 chassis. M113s would be better for manpads (man portable AD systems) than for the ADATs.With the ADATs (AD Anti-Tank system) the turret is so heavy that the veh can be unstable and has difficulty moving along, it's very tough on the power-pack. Originally the plan was that the Leopard would be replaced, and the 120 Leopards would be divided into two groups, 60 would be kept as is for Armr Recce, and the other 60 would be ADATS and Engr vehs. How sweet that would have been! I think maybe the Bison would be best for our purposes. Good tactical mobility, and great strategic mobility, plus not too heavy on maintenance. The problem is that M113s reqr a fair bit of maintenance. I know my unit was offered a dozen or more M113s but we haven't the budget, or the maintainers to keep them in good repair. So we passed. I'm not certain what happened to them, I think maybe the bde took them for the LI Bn.
Posts: 24 | From: Montreal, Quebec, Canada | Registered: Jun 2000
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